On 28 Dec 1998 Shaun.Hendricks@bergenbrunswig.com wrote:
> -----------------------------
> I'll admit right off the bat that I've never driven or ridden in a V10
> ram, but I am pretty confident that I can take just about any of 'em, and
> I'm far from the fastest Dak on this list. I think I could safely bet the
> farm on Tom's 11.5@118 Dak or Dahrl's 10.68@125 being able to outrun a
> big ol' dualie. ;-)
> -----------------------------
>
> The truth is, most V-10 owners do get them for towing and not racing. Just
> because you haven't seen one setup for this doesn't mean they don't (or can't)
> do it (I've seen one). It doesn't matter WHAT vehicle you drive, the power to
> weight ratio governs everything. The only Dakota that could beat a STOCK V-10
> with the correct transmission and rearend for applying it's power to the
> track, would have to have over 340 ft lbs of torque. This is done by taking
> the weight of a Dakota and the weight of a V-10 Ram and applying a ratio. My
> calcs have it at (apprx) 4000lbs vs 5000lbs. If we go light and have the V-10
> at 420 ft lbs of torque, then the Dak must have 340 ft lbs of torque to equal
> the power of the ram. I haven't seen anyone on this list post numbers like
> that.
Would that be flywheel or rear wheel torque? I've estimated my
flywheel torque at somewhere in the neighborhood of 400 lb-ft. My
best time to date is a 14.58@93.55 with a "race weight" (same as
the "everyday driving weight") ;-) of 4200lbs. Of course, to keep
it fair, we should probably restrict it to completely stock vehicles,
and the same type of vehicle at that. (i.e. regular cab ram vs regular
cab dak, etc.)
> -----------------------------
> I've never understood the "how far can you patch out?" folks. :-) Tires
> that aren't hooked up don't do anyone except your competitor any good. Its
> one
> of the basic philosophies of drag racing. You lift, you lose; you spin,
> you lose.
> :-) That Ram you saw obviously has a lot of torque, but personally, I
> prefer to
> have the low end a little weak to allow the tires to hook, then start churning
> out the real power at midrange and high end where traction isn't such a
> big issue.
> ------------------------------
>
> What burning rubber prooves is *where* you can hook up at full throttle.
> Of course if you lay down 15' of rubber on a regular basis then it stands to
> reason that someone who lays down 25' has a more powerful motor. All it
> really prooves is that you can do it. I agree with you. I'm of the opinion
> to lay off the throttle a bit and wait until you're fully hooked and then
> floor it. That's the skill of drag racing though. I used it as a
> demonstration of raw power. This trucks tires were over a foot wide and he
> still dropped enough rubber to embarass everyone else. If he can hook up with
> that kind of power he'd clobber people. Problem is, he's a truck and there's
> no weight in the bed. A 4x4 might do better... but you lose a lot of power
> through the transaxle and that's even to the rear wheels...
Ahh, Ok. I see what you're saying. Of course, there are a lot of
variables involved here too. (Tires, rearend, tranny) My inslictas
would spin if someone looked at 'em funny, but my Firehawks grab a lot
better, and hook sooner. Additionally, someone with a 4.88 rearend needs a
lot less power to lay down a big patch of rubber than someone with a 3.05
rearend. Also, the ratio of the gear you spin 'em in will be a big factor
too, so (IMHO), unless you can keep all the variables relatively stable, this
method of setting up the "power food chain" is prone to some errors.
>
> ------------------------------
> ? I didn't mean to imply that it was any less of an engine, just that
> it was better suited to towing than speed. Heck, I love the pushrod engine!
> Easy to understand, easy to work on... No DOHC for me, thanks! :-) It just
> depends on what you want to do with your truck. I'm admittedly a speed freak,
>
> my main interest is in how fast I can get down the 1/4 mile. So, I'll keep my
>
> V8. (Well, I'll take the 360...) ;-) The V10 just doesn't appear to be well
> suited to drag racing.
>
> I've never seen a V10 Ram at the dragstrip, but now you've piqued my
> curiosity. Anyone know about what they run in the 1/4? I think the
> 360 equipped SS/T / Indy Ram's run in the 16's somewhere; seems to me
> that subtracting 2 seconds is a fairly tall order for a V8->V10 swap.
> ------------------------------
>
> Actually, I was responding to the first persons comments there, not yours
> (sorry). In this case though... I've driven a V-10, it's accelleration made
Oops. Sorry. :-)
> my Dakota pale. You start the truck in 2nd, not first, and you have to pull
> your body out of the seat after you're done. It's an amazing ride. I still
> spun the tires... (oops)(duellies too). It did put a big ol' grin across my
> face though. That went away when I was imagining living at the gas station
> and paying the extra $5000 for the truck. Then I found out my Dak guzzles
> nearly as much gas as the V-10. I still couldn't have afforded the extra
> money though, so I'm content.
> I'm just imagining that same V-10 shoved into a Durango or Dakota. With
> the reduced weight, and some serious drive-train mods, you could really start
> embarassing some folks on the track. Especially if you made the truck in
> "Stealth" mode.... your exhaust note would probably give you away though...
Heh heh heh! Yeah, dual 3" pipes or somethin'... :-)
> We really aren't discussing the practicality of this vehicle... but then,
> who on the list wants a totally practical truck?
>
Yep, I see your point. I never did hear back from the guy who put a
V10 ram engine in his '92 Dakota. He said it was a lot of work (involved
some considerable drivetrain work too), but that he intended to do it
again with another Dakota. It would have been interesting to hear
about its dragstrip behavior.
-Jon-
.--- stei0302@cs.fredonia.edu ----------------------------------------.
| Jon Steiger * AOPA, DoD, EAA, MP Race Team, NMA, SPA, USUA * RP-SEL |
| '96 Dodge Dakota v8 SLT CC (14.58@93.55), '96 Kolb FireFly 447 |
`--------------------------- http://www.cs.fredonia.edu/~stei0302/ ---'
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