Re: RE:DML Manual Trans

From: Gary Shook (gary.shook@mci.com)
Date: Mon Dec 28 1998 - 20:05:05 EST


Sorry for the late response, but I've been busy w/ work... got about 2000
messages behind in my DML folder!

>----------------
>If he has the Diesel, he's got the NV4500... it's a steel case version...
>how much weight is he towing? the "lock nut" issue is either from really
>heavy loads (heard about a guy having the problem with 31,000Lbs GCWR), or
>from "lugging" the engine... keep the rpms above 1600-1700 in 5th...
>----------------
>
> He tows 5th Wheel RV's for a national hauling company (He used to drive
Big
>Rigs for a living so he knows how to handle the engines). They vary
between
>8000lb - 18000lbs and never exceeed the 18,000. The "locknut" issue is
caused
>by imbaciles being allowed to design transmissions. New Venture (the NV in
>the NV3500/4500) did make the 4500 with a (soft) steel case (he's had to
have
>it repaired as well) but it's "innards" are exactly the same as the 3500
from
>everything we've seen (which is why I call it a 3500, it's different in
name
>only). The 5th gear joins the Mainshaft on a set of splines that are only
1/2
>inch across, even though the gear itself has over 2 inches that could be
>attached to the shaft. It appears that the shaft comes machined for the
full
>2 inches but NV seems to think that milling off the splines on the shaft
down
>to 1/2 inch makes sense. The splines wear so rapidly on the shaft that the
>gear starts to "wiggle" and rotates the locknut right off the shaft. The
gear
>slips back on the shaft, now that no nut holds it, and you lose 5th gear.
>Even if the nut held, the splines would eventually wear and the gear would
>spin on the shaft. It's pretty obvious that NV "built in" a flaw so that
it
>would last just long enough to get out of warranty and die. The only way
to
>avoid this is not to tow in 5th (the owners manual says that it's okay to
tow
>in 5th) and get terrible gas mileage and be limited to 50mph. This single
>problem and Chryslers apathy towards it is costing them dearly in the
>reputation department amonst heavy haulers and RV'ers. Ford is absolutly
>ripping Dodge apart in that area now because of the crap they put into the
>truck for a transmission.

It sounds like he falls under the heavy load category.. I didn't mean to
make it sound like you had to "overload" the truck to get it to fail... I do
agree that it's a defect, but one that only surfaces under specific
conditions... someone who's racing 1/4 mile in a Dak will NEVER see this
failure.

>
>----------------
>check the archives.. somebody who worked Volvo gear splitters 30 years ago
>said the Gear Vendor unit was the same design.. they just bought the old
>design, and he said they had LOTS of problems... and did NOT reccommend
>running them!
>----------------
>
> This design does not appear to be from 30 years ago, and it's competitor
>from "US Gears" looks like it did so someone may be confused about that.
It's
>a simple planetary arrangement (there's very few moving parts) and is being
>used on thousands of Tractors, trucks, RV's and pickups all across the US
and
>the world. They guarantee the gearset for life and will pay for any damage
>the unit may have caused the operating vehicle including labor. They
install
>the unit so there's no chance of an inexperienced screw-up. It seems
pretty
>solid to me, and all the RV's mags were raving about it.
>
entirely possible, I have no first hand experience with any gear splitters..
just was making sure you knew what you were getting into.

>----------------
>with the exception of the GM 6.2- it's just a gas block with different
>heads... it doesn't have the bearing area required for longivity (but I
have
>heard of them running to 400,000mi- but that's an exception) a Cummins has
>twice the bearing area of a Ford Powerstroke as well.... but in general,
>----------------
>
> This is just not so Gary. The Cummings turbo diesel is an in-line 6
>cylinder engine that is used on Big Rigs, RV's, Boats (Huge ones, and fast
>ones), Generators, Dodge Pickups and Tractors. It is NOT a converted gas
>engine and never was. It was designed from the ground up as one of the
most
>powerful compact diesel motors available. This exact same engine can
develop
>over 500 hp and 900 lbs of torque with nearly no modifications. It is
tuned
>"down" in the Dodge Trucks because the trannys and frame cannot handle that
>kind of power. A friend of my fathers turned the power back up on the
engine
>and ripped his motor mounts right out of the truck on an engine rev. This
>same engine can be found in several Rigs today with the numbers I gave you.
>It's identical.
> My fathers truck has over 200,000 miles on it and all he does is change
the
>oil & filters and have the valves checked periodically. The motor has
NEVER
>given him a single problem. All problems with the truck stem from a crappy
>transmission. Ford keeps doing "stop gap" measures to try and make their
>diesels match the Dodge but all CC has to do it beef up the frame and
tranny
>and re-tune the motor up a bit and Ford is playing catch up again. The odd
>thing is that CC has NOT addressed the transmission issues for current
owners
>(They are coming out with the new 6 speed that is supposed to be heavier
built
>than the NV4500 but you have to buy a '99 Cummings Turbo or V10) and it's
>pissing them off. The life expectancy of this engine is well over a
million
>miles, but Cummings does not warranty it for that length of time.
> If you have any problems with this information you may call Cummings
>directly. This information is readily available from many sources, but
>Cummings would be a good place to start. This is the best Diesel engine
>placed in a pickup on the road today. This is not disputed, even by CC's
>competitiors. Dodge made a killer deal when they signed Cummings up for
the
>long haul. The engine is worth every penny you pay for it, and when the
V10
>dies at 150K miles, you can drive by laughing your ass off with a Cummings
>Turbo Diesel knowing that your motor is barely broken in...
>
You got this one switched around... I was actually ragging on the GM
6.2L.... I believe the Cummins to be a VERY reliable and powerful engine...
So are CAT Diesels, I was talking up the longevity of Diesels in general,
but wanted to single out the GM 6.2 as a possible exception... if nothing
else, it's very underpowered.

It'll be interesting to see what happens when the agreement w/ Cummins
expires (2002, I think) now that it's DC instead of CC... They even have a
new concept truck (Power Wagon) that uses a Cat Diesel... that runs on a
hybrid fuel...

Just wanted to clarify some of my statements that seemed to be taken out of
context..

Gary Shook



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